- 9 months ago
ITL ranks the current quarterbacks in the NFL playoffs and debates where C.J. Stroud stacks up among the best playing in January.
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00:00No position is more important in the National Football League
00:02and in football in general than the quarterback position.
00:05In fact, sometimes we'll oversimplify and we will rank things
00:08or judge things simply off of the quarterback.
00:10And so I don't want to go to that degree,
00:12but I am interested in how we are viewing the quarterback landscape
00:16of these playoffs.
00:17We kind of talk about the teams just in general
00:19and how it's kind of open and there's only a few teams
00:22that you really look at as dominant forces.
00:24But I kind of want to power rank the quarterbacks here,
00:27and it's all to the end of how are you viewing C.J. Stroud
00:30headed into these playoffs?
00:32Well, I'm just looking at the AFC right now.
00:34Do you want to go by conference?
00:35We can.
00:36Because that's what matters.
00:37But I kind of want to go all the way across if you want.
00:39We will, but I'm like what matters the most to us
00:42and Houston Texans fans right now is the AFC.
00:46I mean, it is a very clear number one.
00:50Yeah, that's Josh Allen.
00:51It's Josh Allen.
00:52And you know what's annoyed me about this?
00:54And again, the reason why I put the disclaimer
00:56on the front side of this conversation is,
00:59have you seen all the people that as soon as the Ravens
01:02got knocked out in that final game, they're like,
01:04oh, well, Josh Allen now has to win it.
01:06No, he doesn't.
01:07That's not how this works.
01:08No, because the rush defense, we talked about it a little bit,
01:10because so many other factors, and a team might be better.
01:14They're the six seed.
01:15Yeah, the team around him sucks.
01:15They're the six seed, yeah.
01:17The team around him is not good enough.
01:19Well, the team around him and James Cook,
01:21because James Cook is right along with him.
01:23But everybody else, I look around and I go, hey, y'all the pips.
01:26Yeah.
01:27It is Josh Allen, James Cook, and the pips.
01:29Yeah.
01:29And so, but he very clearly is the best quarterback that we have going right now
01:34in the playoffs.
01:35But then.
01:36And you almost cannot have a wrong answer.
01:40Even though I would think most people would lean either Bo Nix or Drake May 2nd,
01:45you know, choose your favorite flavor.
01:48But they both have questions.
01:51You know, they both have, you know, not a lot of experience,
01:54really sort of just emerging, et cetera.
01:58Who would you put?
01:59Who would you put second?
02:00It's rough because I think we also have, there's a level, there's two facets.
02:04There is, in the short term, in like their current form, how are they playing?
02:10And then there's a long-term belief that you have.
02:15And I think the answer that I would go with second, because of circumstance,
02:19because of current play, has a cognitive dissonance that's created
02:22because of a long-term question that you have with them.
02:26I think it's probably Trevor Lawrence.
02:28I think it's Trevor Lawrence is certainly in the mix right there
02:31because of how he's playing right now.
02:33But you see what I'm saying, right?
02:34Yeah, you can't have a lot of confidence in him.
02:39Or at least you haven't, the way that he's played.
02:41I mean, he got that contract, and we have, to this point,
02:44or at least to this season, been like,
02:46ain't no way that you're paying him to do that.
02:48But the talent has been there ever since he was drafted,
02:51even in those earlier facets.
02:53It just hasn't come all together.
02:54And it feels like Liam Cohen has been the dude,
02:56with the help of Jacoby Myers, sliding guys into the right place in this offense.
03:00Did you hear Liam Cohen talking about him yesterday?
03:01I didn't. I missed it.
03:02Liam Cohen was talking about him like D'Amico talks about Togiai.
03:06I mean, he was raving.
03:08And I imagine for Liam Cohen, right,
03:10and this is not to denigrate Baker Mayfield by any means,
03:13but you have all the aptitude to drive.
03:18It's like you put this together, right?
03:20You're working on an F1 team,
03:22and your team has built the perfect car, right?
03:24You got the best car on the grid,
03:26but then you get your Lando Norris.
03:28I don't know who was actually at top.
03:30I forgot who won F1 this year.
03:31Please don't get me.
03:32I don't usually watch this.
03:33But you get your guy,
03:35your driver that feels like he knows how to operate the car perfectly.
03:38That's what it feels like that he's doing there.
03:40So I understand that from his perspective.
03:41Yeah.
03:42What's interesting is, you know,
03:44if you go how they're playing right now,
03:45I think it's Josh Allen and Trevor Lawrence,
03:48and then you have Bo Nix and Drake May.
03:51You're putting them both on the same line?
03:53I think I am.
03:54Really?
03:54Over Justin Herbert?
03:56Ain't no way I'm putting him over Herbert.
03:57Actually, I feel weird because I put Drake.
03:59I'm putting him over Herbert.
04:00I have Drake May under T-Law,
04:01and I might be doing too much there.
04:03We talked about this yesterday,
04:04about the coaching and the ways that your offense coordinator
04:06and your head coach can probably help mitigate
04:08some of these things for Drake May.
04:09No, they will not be on the field,
04:11but yes, they can prime him
04:12and give him the best opportunity to be successful.
04:14And if we're just talking about that recent time period,
04:17he is probably, he's playing better than T-Law.
04:19Should I have put him above T-Law for the experience?
04:22No.
04:22He is as close to-
04:24Have you seen Lawrence's numbers in the last five games?
04:26You're right, but he's as close to MVP caliber as we have.
04:29Yeah, I think we kind of hold him back on Drake May
04:33because, you know, this is his first time here.
04:36Yeah.
04:38What's interesting, though-
04:38At least he has to be third, at the very least.
04:40Yeah, I would put him third or fourth,
04:43tied with Bo Nix.
04:44I don't think I can tie both.
04:46Really?
04:46I'm telling you, I don't want to.
04:48He's been playing solid, man.
04:49It's hard to, you know, buy in,
04:51and then you see what-
04:52He's doing just enough for them to win, man.
04:54Yeah, yeah.
04:56He is.
04:57Nobody's screwed up anything, but he's doing just enough.
04:59Are we doing the thing where we're letting the remainder
05:01of what the Chargers are doing
05:02not have appreciation for what Justin Herbert has done?
05:06I've always said, and for years,
05:08I've loved Justin Herbert.
05:09I just don't, I just can't buy in right now
05:12with Herbert or the Chargers.
05:13I think I'd put Herbert over Bo Nix.
05:18You would?
05:18I think I would.
05:19You know Aaron Rodgers is still out there.
05:21I do.
05:22Well, you say Aaron Rodgers.
05:23You know that we have not mentioned C.J. Stroud.
05:25We have not.
05:25So let's start having this conference,
05:27because at this point,
05:27it doesn't seem like we have a definitive.
05:29It feels like we have a one, two, three
05:30that we're comfortable with.
05:31Mm-hmm.
05:31How are you feeling about C.J. Stroud
05:34as it relates to the remainder of the quarterbacks
05:36in the AFC playoffs at this moment?
05:37I think he's just in the mix right behind those top three.
05:41It's choose your favorite one,
05:43and I don't think it's necessarily,
05:46because he's made some fantastic plays, man.
05:48He has made individually some fantastic plays,
05:50kept drives alive, you know,
05:52done, made some big plays, big, you know,
05:54moments, et cetera.
05:57Okay, plays, moments.
05:59But that's not play.
06:01That's not drives.
06:02That's not quarters.
06:03That's not halves.
06:05Yeah, exactly.
06:06And I think it's not necessarily all his fault.
06:08We've talked about it a million times.
06:09It's what they want out of him.
06:11You know, he's not,
06:13because it's always insulting when you say game manager.
06:16He's not that, but he's a cut above that.
06:18So he should be in the same senses as like a Bo Nix then.
06:21Well, that's what's happening.
06:22And that's why I wanted to unearth
06:24with trying to kind of stack the way that we felt
06:26about these quarterbacks.
06:27And I think it gets even more interesting
06:29when you start looking over at the NFC,
06:30but we could stick with the AFC at this point.
06:32And the question I have is, one,
06:36because, again, current run of form
06:38and the entirety of how you feel about this quarterback,
06:41how would you feel about CJ?
06:43Do you think that he's played his best football,
06:44or do you think that he's capable
06:45in this time period to elevate?
06:47Because I think that that could also create,
06:49that could widen the margin.
06:50In fact, I think of anything that you have in the playoffs,
06:54the thing that gives you the most opportunity
06:56to widen your margin and give you a better chance
06:58of going deep in this,
07:00is CJ Stroud raising his level.
07:02But the question I have is,
07:04considering the circumstances of the offense
07:06and how they've ran it
07:07and what they have available to them,
07:09how viable does that feel to you?
07:11I just feel with CJ Stroud,
07:13I just mentioned it,
07:15he's doing what they want him to do.
07:17And he's making the big plays
07:18when he sees the opportunity
07:19and gets it done.
07:21And that's not his fault.
07:24It's not his fault.
07:25It's how they win.
07:26It's what they want.
07:27Here's where it gets interesting.
07:29Let's quit dilly-dallying around.
07:31Let's put a number.
07:32Let's go 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7.
07:35In the AFC?
07:36Where would he be?
07:39I want to put him right around where we are,
07:424, 5.
07:43But also, I recognize I'm having a hard time
07:46being as objective as I want to
07:49because I'm really leaning on
07:51the good plays that I'm seeing him,
07:53the keyhole throws that he's having.
07:55And he also said that he felt like
07:56Week 18 was probably his best grasp
07:59of orchestrating all the things
08:02in this offense.
08:03Can I project that forward?
08:05But then also, can I talk about the instances
08:07where sometimes the pass protection elements
08:09that we talked about where we go,
08:11some of that is making sure the coaches
08:12have him, give him an answer,
08:14and some of that is him making sure
08:15he utilizes those answers.
08:17Also, give me a little bit of pause.
08:19The reason why I wasn't willing
08:20to put Bo Nix immediately above him
08:22is I think that Bo Nix benefits from
08:24he gets carried for a long period of time
08:27until the time where he can pull
08:29something beautiful out of this keister.
08:30Who does that sound like?
08:31Does that feel like C.J. to you?
08:32Who does that sound like?
08:34Oh, great defense.
08:35Who does that sound like?
08:37That's fair.
08:38Right?
08:38I think a lot of people, though,
08:39especially if you watch the NFL
08:41and all that stuff,
08:42a lot of people in their hearts
08:43know that C.J. Stroud is probably
08:45they'll take C.J. Stroud over Bo Nix.
08:48All day, every day.
08:48So we just kind of thinking
08:50in the playoff format.
08:52Yeah, I'd put C.J. over Bo.
08:53Yeah, C.J. Stroud will be C.J. Stroud.
08:55We've seen it.
08:56C.J. over Justin?
08:58But we can, no, hold on.
08:59We can agree on that.
09:01But if we're talking about
09:02how they're playing,
09:03he's playing exactly like Bo Nix.
09:05And I think that even if I'm going
09:08with where you're going,
09:09the tiebreaker is absolutely the long term.
09:11We've seen C.J. be exquisite.
09:14Oh, for sure.
09:15So I think that the idea
09:16that that could come, exquisite.
09:17Exquisite.
09:18Exquisite.
09:18Mwah.
09:19The diamond on the banner
09:22got me to that place.
09:23I got to use the fancy words.
09:25So one, Josh Allen.
09:26Yes.
09:27Stop me when you disagree.
09:28Two, Trevor Lawrence.
09:30I'm fine with it.
09:31Three, Drake May.
09:32Yeah.
09:32Four, Justin Herbert, Aaron Rodgers.
09:38Honestly, I was thinking Justin Herbert,
09:40maybe two or three.
09:41Really?
09:41That's what I was like.
09:42Yeah, I was thinking two or three.
09:43Herbert's such a weird circumstance
09:45because the rest of everything around him
09:46is crumbling, including his own body.
09:48Yeah.
09:49Yeah.
09:49And so the best that you can put C.J. Stroud
09:51is either five or six,
09:52depending on what you compare,
09:53contrast with Bo Nix.
09:56Actually, Aaron Rodgers as well.
09:58That's crazy.
10:00That's nuts.
10:01And some of this is...
10:03This is a playoff with no Patrick Mahomes,
10:05no Lamar, Jackson.
10:06Yeah.
10:08It's going to be incumbent upon C.J.
10:11to do what he's asked, first and foremost,
10:14but I think that...
10:16Then do more.
10:17That's going to be the thing.
10:18We need rookie C.J. Stroud out there, man.
10:22If it was rookie C.J. Stroud,
10:23he would be number two.
10:24For sure.
10:26For sure.
10:27I mean, nothing lower than three.
10:29Nothing lower than three.
10:29Nothing lower than three.
10:30Nothing lower than three.
10:31Without question.
10:32And that's before we even talk about
10:34what's happening on the NFC side,
10:36where, to be fair,
10:37there's some dicey ones in there,
10:40like Sam Darnold.
10:41I don't know how you feel about it.
10:42Matt Stafford is clearly the one
10:43that you throw up there.
10:44Stafford one, Darnold two?
10:47No, I don't feel confident enough
10:49about Sam Darnold.
10:50Well, the options are kind of limited.
10:52Brock Purdy gets an interesting shout,
10:54and then Jordan Love gets an interesting shout.
10:57Caleb Williams?
10:57Although Jordan Love is coming off an injury,
10:59Caleb Williams would be an interesting shout as well.
11:02But, yeah, the point being...
11:04Oh, yeah, by the way,
11:04Jalen Hurts is still playing.
11:06He is.
11:07That offense in general is the thing
11:09that scares me in some ways.
11:11But, yeah, this is a place where,
11:13if we're being realistic,
11:14C.J. Stroud does not feel like he's top-half quarterback,
11:18at least in the current run of things.
11:21And that's understanding that the offense
11:23somewhat has a governor on,
11:24and it's put in the place that it is.
11:27But him elevating his play,
11:29I think that that shows that there's a lot of room here
11:31for him to elevate his play,
11:34for him to play his best football,
11:35and for him to miss in these playoffs.
11:39Basically what we're saying is,
11:40all right, it's time, C.J.
11:42It's time to show us that.
11:43Are they going to allow C.J.
11:45to do those things?
11:48And that's also a big underlying portion of this.
11:51Somebody said,
11:52Herbert, dude chokes in the playoffs,
11:5560 rating, come on, be real.
11:56And maybe I need to have more consideration for him
11:59and his playoffs.
11:59I mean, are we talking about all of that stuff in there?
12:01Well, because I did that with Drake May.
12:02I did do that with Drake May as a rookie in the playoffs.
12:04So it would only be fair for me to then bring up
12:07that Justin Herbert in the playoffs
12:08has had a little bit of a rough time.
12:10I think that that is a fair point to make.
12:11But I'm also not going to go to the place
12:13where the 8-3-2 goes and they go,
12:15Texans won 12 games,
12:16so he is better than all the people who won 12 games.
12:18Wins are not a quarterback stat.
12:19And if there was ever a season in Texans history
12:21to show you that, this would be the one, right?
12:23And I don't say that as somebody,
12:25I am not in a place where I'm trying
12:27to openly bash C.J. Stroud.
12:28But yeah, how many of those wins
12:30do you want to put squarely at C.J.?
12:32Yeah, David Smith's got three of them.
12:36So, but again, I say all this
12:38not to knock on C.J. Stroud,
12:40but to point out this is where I think
12:42the context of C.J. Stroud's season
12:45could very much change
12:46just off of the strength of him showing up
12:48and being excellent in these games.
12:50And even with me saying excellent,
12:53I don't even know that it needs to be
12:54the incredible plays.
12:56I think it's just do what he's done well
12:58in these stretches,
12:59especially in the stretch since he's come back,
13:01but do it for the entirety of a game
13:02as opposed to some of these stretches
13:04that it seems like it happens with.
13:06And again, we may need to dig in on this
13:07maybe even tomorrow.
13:08Let's do it.
13:08Will they even fathom the idea
13:12of allowing him to loosen the reins a little?